Skiddadle Skeddoodle, you're a Tornoodle.

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Re: Skiddadle Skeddoodle, you're a Tornoodle.

Post by Snake » Tue Oct 01, 2019 1:09 am

If anything, those stacks got to slow down a LOT. I don't want to take words out of Slydria's mouth but they probably wouldn't want it like this either.

UL + 1 = 25 per critical hit. And critical hits are not hard to land on a sword that by default can have 50% Critical Hit chance. I'd rather it get the Salamander treatment. Against non-PCs, it should keep this power, but against players, it should be capped at 5~10 per Critical Hit or something.
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Re: Skiddadle Skeddoodle, you're a Tornoodle.

Post by Spoops » Tue Oct 01, 2019 1:17 am

I think the salamander treatment can work out somewhat, once every 5 or 6 hits can at least work out, still doesn't subtract from the weapon itself.

But as it stands, once every 4 hits is effectively a neutral gain for the Tarnada, except now you can predict it and make probably even more disgusting combos involving it, like aforementioned Scarlet Twister.

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Re: Skiddadle Skeddoodle, you're a Tornoodle.

Post by Senna » Tue Oct 01, 2019 3:22 am

I mean the sword base by itself is already disgustingly good. Like you can have 120+ crit chance without trying. Add perfect poise 25+, ghost rising game or kensei -20 crit evade and they'll damn near crit people who even stacks crit evade (People with 120 crit evade, the user will have a 50 or close to 50% chance. The average crit evade, people that aren't black knights is 60 so you see where this is going). If we throw the Hexer bonus then that's like another +25-50 crit. It's damn near VA levels of bullshit. Hitting ain't even a problem since people normally have methods to take care of that such has borneblood, curse, freeze and etc. Now let's talk about per a crit real quick. 25 gather per a crit, they can crit two to three times a turn, that's 50-75, so literally EVERY TWO TURNS PEOPLE WILL BE HIT WITH A VYDEL OF DEATH. THAT MAKES THE SWORD TWICE AS STRONG AS IT IS NOW. That's only FEEDING the problem, not helping it.

This literally makes building a normal tank completely shit now if it's not a Black Knight tank and that's really bad. That's killing the remaining flexibility the game has left.

Hell, it'll be even more consistent in a team battle if you manage to hit three people at once with a sidecut since you'll have much more targets. Using Youkais and wraith guard will only hinder you even more.

This isn't a nerf, this is a massive buff.

Current the sword is dangerous BECAUSE of Vydel and what the effect it. At least currently by gods will you won't get hit by one for a match. Now it's just certain you're screwed by it.

Two suggestions was post on this, the scaling nerf with base nerf and lower the number, give it the salamander treatment whereas it takes more than four crits (Like UL/3), can't stack against the same person until next turn after critical STRIKING to avoid back to back group sidecuts to super stack it.
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Re: Skiddadle Skeddoodle, you're a Tornoodle.

Post by Spoops » Tue Oct 01, 2019 3:33 am

I believe Sly's original idea for the weapon is when you accumulate 100 charges of Tarnada's Vydel, you gain access to cast it alone for 3m, which is far far more managable than having it be free on crit, a free invocation on crit that scatters everyone around for massive damage and knocking them down is probably one of the most game changing effects right now, outside of like a round 0 sonic shell or immunities put up.

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Re: Skiddadle Skeddoodle, you're a Tornoodle.

Post by Senna » Tue Oct 01, 2019 4:03 am

IF that's Sly's original idea, that's much better than the update Dev has for us lol. After reading Sly's post, I can understand where the mix up/misunderstanding happened because I had to read it twice to get what they were saying. At least people can silence and prevent it from happening in Sly's post. I HOPE dev fixes it instead, as well as somewhat lower the amount of charge per a crit so people won't need to constantly rush every two rounds to silence or prevent them from using it. Because that by itself is alotta work against someone that doesn't really need it to do massive damage and someone that can just kite to max range and just loluse it.
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Re: Skiddadle Skeddoodle, you're a Tornoodle.

Post by Slydria » Tue Oct 01, 2019 6:43 am

Slydria wrote:
Fri Jun 21, 2019 7:59 pm
Currently there's a UL% chance on a critical to follow up the attack with the Vydel which leads a potentially powerful and disruptive burst.
After gaining enough Tornado Charges (e.g. 100), you are then able to consume them all to manually cast the Tarnada's variant of Vydel. (I imagine this would be a 3 Momentum, 0 FP cost skill, much like an already Invoked Vydel.)
I think by changing it to work this way, it makes the weapon more predictable (thereby easier to prepare a defense again) and removes the sheer burst of damage and lowers the effective Momentum trade when activated.
I'm honestly confused at how my idea was misconstrued...? I thought I made myself quite clear. :|
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Re: Skiddadle Skeddoodle, you're a Tornoodle.

Post by Senna » Tue Oct 01, 2019 9:17 am

If you scan it, then yeah, you'll overlook some words. In any case, it comes down to this, it's between Dev misunderstanding it or we misunderstanding Dev's update page.
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Re: Skiddadle Skeddoodle, you're a Tornoodle.

Post by Snake » Tue Oct 01, 2019 11:12 am

Salamander treatment and be done with it. That's busted in PvP because it will certainly stack too fast.

No need for overly complicated high-intellectual scuffles of utmost basic native English grammar misconceptions of words and sentences. We're one fix away for Tarnada to be put at a decent and more balanced position without needing to lower its scaling to 75% total to compensate its sheer power.
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Re: Skiddadle Skeddoodle, you're a Tornoodle.

Post by Neus » Tue Oct 01, 2019 11:00 pm

People are greatly overreacting to something that is very clearly a nerf except in situations where the Tarnada user gets very unlucky. The RNG contributed a lot to how powerful Tarnada was, because getting a Vydel on your first/second attack was a huge advantage. Now it is predictable and can even be interrupted with Null Shell/Steal. Acting like it's a buff in any sense is just silly.

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Re: Skiddadle Skeddoodle, you're a Tornoodle.

Post by WaifuApple » Wed Oct 02, 2019 12:43 am

- It's now more consistent for its predictability, meaning instead of the possibility of it never going off in a battle due to your luck, you can now guarantee you'll pull it off in one turn

- New combos come from this predictability. Get people dragged into range and then swing your sword for a guaranteed Vydel because you can now tell when it'll happen and plan for it as a Tarnada user.

- Not every class has a way to null this and they can build it up faster than you can null unless you're running steal - and in that case, you'd probably die quickly to the sword itself, never mind the Vydel.

I know this is your game and all, but I don't think you realise that honestly, the boons you just gave it basically cancel out the drawbacks you gave it. Please listen to us when we say that with the scaling and stats it has, and the new boons you've given it - This is more than a kneejerk overreaction. The Tarnada wasn't, and still won't be healthy for the game this way. There is still little reason to use anything else over it, even without the Vydel.

Predictable doesn't mean avoidable either - You could see something from a mile away and still be hopeless to do anything about it. You've essentially given it a solely conditional nerf - and buffed it at the same time.
Last edited by WaifuApple on Wed Oct 02, 2019 12:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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